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habitation tax charges?

Posted by splinterx2 - Created: 4 years ago
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10 replies (Showing replies: 1 to 10)

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Posted by WizardofOz-226715 - 4 years ago

topofthetop is right, and I think if your landlord is paying no tax whatsoever from his earnings on the flat - the least he could do is pay the taxe d'habitation without trying to claw it back from you too.

As I said in my previous post - say you are very happy to pay your taxe d'habitation, but only when it has your name on it....... :)  - your Landlord might decide it's not worth the hassle.

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Posted by thetopofthetop - 4 years ago

the taxe d'habitation depend on your flat (size, how is expensive the area....) + your salary.

with a formula all inclusive, I think your owner didn't declare you in order to do not pay tax for the money who he is earning from you. And the government charged him as if the flat was empty (sometimes this amount is expensive in order to encourage owner to do not let a flat empty)...

it's not the best solution for you because this tax need to be fit to your personal situation and not the situation of the owner.
In case of problem, you can go the tax office and explain the situation, and you request to pay directly the taxe d'habitation... but your owner will be not happy because you report him and he risks after penalty fees for false declaration  ;-) 

taxe fonciere is right = only for the owner and under his name but he can charge you back a small part (rubish tax...), it's legal and normal

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Posted by Pines - 4 years ago

We are in a nearly similar situation as the starter of this topic:

We have rented an appartment since middle of 2012 in which we still live in. The contract is not "French", it is like usually is applied in our homeland ie landlord is not French either. We have had no income in France since the contract was made so we are not registered as taxpayers. Our landlord has also an other appartment here which he uses himself.

The landlord requests us to pay the tax d'habitation which he has received in his name. Are we obliged to pay it? 

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Posted by WizardofOz-226715 - 4 years ago

I've lived here since 1996 and my husband is French. We are Landlords.

There is NO WAY the landlord can pay your tax d'habitation to the taxman - it just doesn't work like that! It is a tax form which arrives to your personal letterbox in your own name which he should never open nor have access to. If you were not "renting" on the 1 jan 2012 then you are not liable for that year.

The only tax he can "tag on" to your rent is a small fraction of his Tax Fonciere - ie the Taxe Ménagere or Rubblish Tax - as you are having your rubbish removed by the council.

Just to keep on  his good side - tell him you're very happy to pay whatever tax is liable as long as your NAME is on it.  I was NEVER involved in ANY tax payments from my tenants to the govt! - what next?

Good luck!

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Posted by splinterx2 - 4 years ago

Thanks again for all your input...

I do agree to keep heads down.... ;)..

Just want some leverage regarding 2012 as the Landlord has been playing this to suit his world and I want him to understand that his first approach was not correct or fair....... and that I now know a lot more about the requrements..... 

He got the tenant to move in and then add on extras to suit his mortgage............ and bills etc.... is not cool............. and yes it's more like a holiday home.........

Next time things will be different....... ;).....

A Life Lesson and no one got hurt...... (on the lighter side) .................. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted by laughingboy-409220 - 4 years ago

If you were doing things by the book... you are correct that technically you should not be liable for 2012 if your rental contract started after 1 Jan 2012. 

However, as regards 2013 I'm afraid that unless you submitted a French tax return from that address for your ncome in 2012 and have received an avis d'impot showing a total household income that is below the threshhold, you will have to pay the full rate. Only French taxpayers get reductions; if you're not a French taxpayer then obviously you can't pay 'your own tax' because your tax has not been calculated. The only circumstances where the tax office charges a reduced rate is on the habitation tax for the principal residence of a person who is on a low income. I presume you didn't fill in a tax return, otherwise this situation wouldn't have arisen. Maybe it's a holiday home, in which case there would be no reduction; maybe you just didn't fill in your tax declaration, in which case you can't expect any concessions if you don't meet your own obligations so best to keep your head down; but whatever the reason, if there is no tax return filed against that address, the full rate of habitation tax is always payable. 

What I'm tactfully suggesting is that if you haven't got a French rental contract, and you've been living in France for a year without submitting a tax return, it's going to be complicated to pop your head above the parapet at this stage and start demanding everything be done by the rules. 

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Posted by splinterx2 - 4 years ago

2013 I can understand..... now... I never said the contract started on the 1st of Jan.....

2012, I was not there on Jan 1st... (x) amount of months with charges which should not be my responsibility. Right? From all the previous comments about Jan 1st..... 

Plus I am happy to pay my own tax, not have the maximum charged to suit the landlord, who may well be just paying the taxes fonciers with the rent from me.... ? 

Yes I feel it is too much........

So much for simple............. 

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Posted by laughingboy-409220 - 4 years ago

Well I'm relived it wasn't an out-of-body experience ;)

Regard the taxe d'hab, frankly I think your best way forward is to pay up unless it seems extortionate. Unless it was specifically agreed and put in writing that you don't have to pay, then under French law, you are liable. 

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Posted by splinterx2 - 4 years ago

Thanks Laughingboy, yes there is no reason for your intrigue as I was keeping it biref and forgot to mention we moved in mid way thorough 2012, therefore 2012 charges appear not to be valid for this tax.

Nothing to do with teleportation,  ;))))).... just  2 different years from 2012 to 2013...

I have tried to speak with the landlord about this tax (and other things) he is adament that we have to have this tax added on to the rent. 

Hence these discussions to get impartial comments and opinions to enlighten us a bit... and feel out which way to proceed.

I  will not be here for 1st Jan 2014....... and now know a lot more about the Taxe d'Habitation.. ;)..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted by laughingboy-409220 - 4 years ago

Why don't you just ask the landlord? As said, it's not a 'correct' situation if you've been renting with no French rental contract in place, so your arrangement is presumably based on mutual trust . The French rental laws exist to protect both you and the landlord and if you have chosen to ignore them, I think asking a lawyer to step in and sort out the muddle at this stage will cost you more than it could save you in the short term. To do things in the correct way he'd have to start from scratch by drawing up proper contracts and charging you for doing so, and you would still have to pay the tax. But if you decide to regularise the situation with a proper contract it might avoid all kinds of problems in the future, but that is something you need to sort out with your landlord.

In fact the landlord probably won't have had the bill for 2013 yet, since as already mentioned the bills are usually sent out in October.

However it's possible he may be paying in montly instalments, based on last year's bill, in which case he should be able to show you some paperwork.

I'm intrigued how you weren't there when you moved in, but if what you're saying is that the contract started on 1 Jan 13, then normally you would be liable to pay the tax for 2013. If in theory you were the 'occupier' then the fact that you weren't actually in the property makes no difference.