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swimming pool fence info?

Posted by davidn-184078 - Created: 14 years ago
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I have been looking for a discription of the types of fence acceptable under the french norms. A Minimum hight of 1.10 meters seems to be clear, but is it nessesary to buy he expensive rigid panel type of fence, or can the rolls of green cross over mesh be used. I realy need to find the most cost effective (and safe) way of doing this for a rental property. I want to install is my self and now have less than a week to go to my first rental.  Any pointers would be most welcome.david n

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10 replies (Showing replies: 1 to 10)

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Posted by rupes67-190336 - 13 years ago

I know this reply is a long time after the questions have been asked but up until now I have not been a position to reply.After seven months of testing we have finally had our fencing product fully approved by AFNOR's recommended laboratory LNE and we will be launching at Piscine Expo 2004 in November.We are sourcing the product in America where it has been used for over 18 years with great success. It is an almost transparent (at least 40% more so than a lot of the other similar products that are on the market) removable mesh fence that can be installed with a little knowledge of DIY and an ability to follow an instruction manual. It has the only patented self-closing, self-locking gate in the USA that does not rely on the use of a top rail meaning that it is almost impossible to climb, as is the fence. I have 3 children 3, 7 and 9 and a self closing and latching gate, rather than a removable access, was imperative for me, as with age disparity, the older children who can swim will not have to remember to close the gate or replace the access panel in order to protect the younger ones.The pricing of this product means that it will retail at about € 3,000 euros including the gate and taxes for a 35 to 40 meter run. It is available in a variety of colours. You will never have a call from a tenant about alarms that go off when they shouldn’t or not going off when they should.Finally, and I know I am biased, but I am also a parent this is by far the best looking product that I have seen on the market since I went into this business and it is by far the safest. The AFNOR standards have been set at the high level that they have for a very good reason - to stop children drowning in swimming pools - so please whatever method you choose to use make sure that you ask for a copy of the certificate of testing as there are a huge number of companies selling products with an official looking logo that says conforms to the norm NF P 90-306. When I have telephoned these companies, and I have done so to all of them, there reply has been " sorry we can't send you a certificate, but we think it conforms" I have since also examined these products and having been through the testing procedure know there is not a chance they would pass.The legislation and fitting requirements are a minefield so please, before you fit anything, make sure you are getting correct advice. An accident or a 45,000 € fine are just not woth it.Please contact me if you need any advice - there is no obligation - as I am only selling this product to DIY stores and approved dealers who undertake installation training programmes.rupert.scott@encloture.com or 06 77 16 86 51Rupes

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Posted by LoriMansour - 14 years ago

As to the rigid pool covers - I don't really understand this.  The only time a rigid cover would work is if you always leave the pool covered. I suppose I could change my habit of leaving our pool uncovered during season to covering every time I (or someone else) is not swimming.??

We have ordered an alarm (Aquasensor chute type) from an enterprise in Nice.  The thing with the alarms - at least this one - our pool is 11 x 5.  The alarm covers up to a 10 x 5 pool.  If your pool is larger, you need TWO !!!!!!!!  That's 1400 euros.  Anyone know of other alarms.  Please no infrared systems, we live in the country (Bedoin - Vaucluse).  We have a lot of bird and bat life here.... need I say more...

Thanks for all the great info.

 

Lori

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Posted by davidn-184078 - 14 years ago

There seem to be two issues, the law, and saftey. I have fitted a pool alarm to comply with the law. I have also fitted a fence, not of the approved type, but very well installed with a self closing gate with two catches, to provide a level of saftey for children. There is no 100% solution except maybe fill the pool in. This is only my opinion, and I belive the person Mike quoted was only expressing his opinion. The fitting of a non conforming fence, although not in it's self illeagal, may not protect an owner from the law. The alarm, though does aparently fullfill the requirements of he law. The other often offered advise is that the best safty is perental vigilance.

 

david n

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Posted by Andy G-190935 - 14 years ago

What are we saying here?<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Can we, or can we not fit our own DIY fences?

My scant information (from the guy at Casto) was that it was illegal to fit any fence except the conforming pool types, thus agreeing with mike's information. 

If I had the choice I would certainly prefer to fit a good quality DIY fence over the expensive and in my opinion rather flimsy looking pool types I have seen. It seems ridiculous to me that a well installed metal wire or even plastic fence should be considered 'unsafe', when an 'after the accident' pool alarm, which will most likely be switched off because it's windy, is considered enough on it's own to conform the regulations.

Think about your reaction time to the pool alarm; your on the loo "that's the third time it's gone off today!". Then consider the time to get to the pool, dive in, and rescue (if you can) a drowning child. In my opinion they are just not good enough on their own.

Andy

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Posted by TonyP-191937 - 14 years ago

I am sure most people will keep the alarms permanently deactivated unless they happen to have small children playing outside.

The Infrared fence is likely to be set off by wild animals, neighbours cats and birds, perhaps moths and bats at night, so it doesnt seem any better than the water alarm.

I think the point about the water alarm is that if you have it, the fence doesnt have to be approved, so if you yhink you need a fence you can do what davidn suggests and install a diy fence.

If the only children are the occasional visitors for afternoon tea, you can skip the fence and maybe turn the alarm on.

The other option is the rigid roll-up cover that you might consider if you need a new cover anyway.  It is much more effective than a fence.

Tony

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Posted by hesketh - 14 years ago

The pool alarm company that I have used are being very helpful and are trying to rectify the problem...if it proves unsuccessful they have suggested an infrared alarm system...only (!!!) another 1400 euro plus fitting on top of the 1000 Euros so far...the only thing that would set this off would be animals and children...will have to check if this one conforms to the AFNOR standards. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

The pool alarm conforms to the Standards and I have all the certificates to say everything is OK as far as the insurance company is concerned, the fact that it goes off every time there is a good gust of wind means that it will only be on when people are there during the day, not 24 hours, as no one wants to get up at 2am to switch it off when the wind blows. What I'm saying is that the government has pushed this through too fast and has obviously not tested the pool alarm rigorously enough. Obviously a fence is the best option but in our case is simply not an option as the pool is directly off the covered terrace.

 

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Posted by Tinker-186005 - 14 years ago

Have you checked with your household insurance company? As you will be relyng on them to pay out if an accident happens, Nice Matin did an article in early May, I expect they keep it in archives, I do remember that the registered rental companies had to pay an enormous fine plus forfieting the right to rent for five years, it maybe worht loosing a weeks rental than being the example that the authorities are looking for,sorry to be so doom and gloom good luckTinker

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Posted by hesketh - 14 years ago

Beware of the AXXXXXXX alarms that conform to the new Government atandards...it doesn't work, the wind blows causing movement on the pool surface and off it goes...It musn't be fitted near the pool pump either...same thing. If the pool is protected from the wind you may be OK

The local company who installed it have been twice so far and are still unable to sort it out. I guess I'm legal as I have one...the fact it doesn't work properly is ridiculous. We need a solution. A fence would have to go through our seating area on the terrace so was not a practical answer. The property is fenced in but not house to pool

Lynn

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Posted by davidn-184078 - 14 years ago

Thanks Mike and Tony, I am planning to go the alarm plus simple non conforming but effective fence route. First price for conforming fence 4000e for d.i.y. Alarm 600e, standard fence d.i.y. 300e.

I hope it's as near leagal as is reasonable.

david n

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Posted by TonyP-191937 - 14 years ago

http://www.bctech.fr/protection/piscaqua.html

for example.

If you have the alarm, but think a fence is a good idea anyway, the fence doesnt have to be agreed.

Another alternative is a rigid cover, (AFNOR of course)

Tony